Turning the spotlight on Chokher Bali which released 22 Years On 2 October, Subhash K Jha shares this fascinating unpublished interview with Rituparno Ghosh about the making of the film that starred Aishwarya Rai.
How does Chokher Bali look to you?
The Bengali audience expects it to be a renewal of Satyajit Ray’s renderings of Rabindranath Tagore’s novels Charulata and Ghaire Bhaire. My Chokher Bali is a very different rendering of Tagore. The national audience would connect Aishwarya’s presence in Bengali literature with Devdas. But my film has as little to do with Devdas as it does with Satyajit Ray’s Charulata. Every period creates its own glamour and nostalgia.
The common man would see the surface connection between Bengali literature and Devdas.
But why do we have to be so rigid about the Bengaliness of it? I think Rabindranath Tagore is universal . The philosophical complexities and lyrical resonances in Tagore go beyond language barriers. Even when Devdas was to be released everyone had reservations about how audiences would react to a defeatist alcoholic hero. Once the film released everything changed. So how can we anticipate the audiences’ reactions? I don’t think Chokher Bali is meant for him for the average man on the street. Perhaps people in Mumbai who ‘ve seen my Bariwali would want to see my film.
And how much does Aishwarya melt into the glamour and nostalgia of Chokher Bali?
She’s quite suited to the role. She ‘s a beautiful woman. But she doesn’t look over-glamorous as my protagonist Binodini. She looks correct. Without any makeup she looks vulnerable and real in my film. That’s the most major achievement of our collaboration. Aishwarya’s look in my film echoes her scenes in the hospital in Hum Dil De Chuke Sanam. Her vibrancy and vitality are tangible.
How was the experience of working with her?
Very nice. She was a very practical and understanding colleague on the sets. She wasn’t well versed in Tagore when she came to the sets. In fact, she made it a point not to read Chokher Bali in an English translation. She just wanted to go by my script. She didn’t want any alternative view. Even about Devdas she told me she didn’t read the novel because she only wanted to go by what Sanjay Bhansali wanted. Because she hadn’t read the novel there was an incomplete understanding of the character. That aided me in creating the Binodini I wanted to create.
How was the experience of making this film ?
It had been my dream to make Chokher Bali for a very long time. I’m as focussed about this film as I was about my first three films. I’m personally taking care of every department. Chokher Bali needs extra caution. This is my first period film, therefore totally alien to me. Even the incidental hawker on the street has to speak and walk correctly.
How different is the experience of working with Mumbai’s stars?
They’re basically all actors. I first worked with a Bombay actor (Kirron Kher) in Bariwali, then in Titli (Mithun Chakraborty). Then Rinkudin (Sharmila Tagore) and Raakheedi in Shubho Mahurat. Kirran and Ash didn’t even know the language. Kirran was a challenge for me.
Was the language a big problem for Aishwarya?
She had done some regional films earlier like Iruvar and Kandukondain Kandukondain. But here, she was slightly more handicapped since she could follow some of the words in Bengali. That complicated things for her . It was made very clear to her from the beginning that she may not be able to dub her own lines. On the last day of shooting I asked her if she could do the dubbing. Ash categorically said she couldn’t. She was reasonable enough to understand she wasn’t capable of speaking the Bengali that was required. A professional actress Sreela Majumdar has done Ash’s dubbing. I remember once Ash called and I made her hear Sreela’s dubbing. And she was happy. In fact, both Raima Sen and Ash ‘s voices are dubbed. Raima has been done Sudipta Chakraborty who played Kirran Kher’s maid in Bariwali. Both Sreela and Sudipta were so dedicated.
But when you dub the performance it becomes another performance altogether!
I disagree. You see, I had taken care of all the inflexions in the script. Sreela Majumdar has a very sweet and clear voice. She made no effort to sound like Ash. In fact Sreela’s voice on Ash’s lips made the character of Binodini complete. I must say Aishwarya has made a terrific effort. Otherwise, Sreela wouldn’t have been able to give so much feeling into the dubbing.
So is Aishwarya Rai your Binodini?
She became Binodini. In the first schedule she was slightly edgy. Everything from the language to the costumes to the Kolkata environment to the costumes without blouses was new to her. She was edgy initially. She didn’t know how to tread the thin line between glamour and naturalism. But after the first schedule , she was fine. We developed a great rapport and we became great friends. I’d consult her before retaining them in the script. She was extremely particular about continuity details. She made notes in her copy of the script. Her hairdresser and makeup person helped her work out details before she came before the camera. In fact, she stopped looking into the mirror after a while. Her major obstacle in becoming one with Binodini was her stardom. But she overcame that to give a memorable performance. A lot of people are waiting for her to fail. But in my opinion Ash hasn’t only given one of her finest performances but also one of the best in my cinema. She’ll be remembered in Chokher Bali not only because she ‘s Aishwarya Rai but also because she’s become Binodini.
She got all the popular awards for Devdas, what about Chokher Bali?
My film won’t even go there. We’re talking about two different kinds of films. Please don’t bring in Devdas . It has a different kind of audience appeal. If they come to see another Devdas they’ll be disappointed. Apart from the same actress there’s no common ground.
Nandita Das feels betrayed by your casting of Aishwarya Rai as Binodini.
Let me make it very clear that I haven’t read what she has to say. But let me tell you what happened. Nandita was supposed to do Chokher Bali three years ago. Before her I had thought of Rituparna Sengupta with whom I worked in Utsab. But she got married and was toying with retirement. Then I talked to Nandita. I did a script reading for her. But it was done in the presence of Rinkudi and her friend the actor K.K. Menon in Delhi. So it wasn’t a formal narration. But of course there was tacit understanding that she’d do the role. Now I hear she had blocked her dates for Chokher Bali. But why? We had never discussed details of her role except for a wig that she needed to wear after she cut her hair for Deepa Mehta’s Water. Beyond that there wasn’t single trial photograph. I needed to see her completely without makeup in a widow’s costume before making up my mind. At that point of time I wasn’t planning Chokher Bali but Shubho Mahurat. Nandita was very upset, almost rude. She told me she’d do Chokher Bali only after re-negotiation. I had never signed her. Besides a director has the liberty to change his mind at any point of time. I signed Nandita for Shubho Mahurat only because we were thinking of working together for a long time. Otherwise anyone could have done Nandita’s role. She has no boxoffice value in Kolkata. I just wanted make space in in my film.
Did you inform Nandita of your changed plans?
When initial discussions with Ash were on I called up Nandita and told her it might be Ash for Chokher Bali. She said to think about it because Ash would be a different Binodini. When Ash was finalized I called Nandita at her home in Delhi. Her brother said she was in the bath and to leave a message with him. I told him to tell her not to block her dates for Chokher Bali because Aishwarya had been finalized. Five minutes later Nandita called and wished me all the best for the film. That was all. After that I don’t know what the fuss is all about.
Perhaps she had her heart set on the role?
I’m sensitive enough to understand her sense of betrayal and anguish. She had her heart set on playing Binodini. But please don’t make it into an ugly issue. I respect Nandita and those statements attributed to her are most unlike her. She’s a very gracious person. I don’t think she’s capable of ugliness. If she felt bad I expect her to confront me. I guess I’m not a good judge of human beings.
Okay, what plans for Chokher Bali?
We’re taking it into one of the major international festivals. I think this film has an international appeal. The flavour and fabric of the time and the Oriental philosophy would appeal to the international cineaste. Ash isn’t keen on dubbing it in Hindi. When she did Kandukondain Kandukondain with Rajiv Menon she had urged him not to dub it in Hindi. Like Menon’s film we’re planning to subtitle it in English and release it in Mumbai.
And your next film?
Yes , it would be in Hindi. Mr Amitabh Bachchan and I’d be working together. He plays a filmmaker. It’s a father-son story . I want Deepti Naval to play Mr Bachchan’s wife and Tabu for another very important role in the film .
